07- 8-05, LearnTexasHoldem:
Question About Tourney Hand
Anyway, here's my question. This happened a few weeks ago and it's been bugging me ever since. (It could be because I haven't had a chance to play since.) Here's the scenario: 19 person, 2 table, nl tourney, very few of whom I've played against, but I heard it was a fairly loose friendly crowd. It was very early, first round of blinds. I'm dealt TT in middle position. Everyone ahead of me folds. I raise 3x BB and get two callers, neither of whom I've played before, one the BB.
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For fun, the dealer runs out the hand: garbage on the turn, 3s on the river. I would have hit the flush. When the winner mucks her hand, I catch a glimpse of her bottom card: Ad. She won't tell me what her other card was. A K or Q of spades and I would have lost, anything else, I would have won a huge pot and been the early chip leader. This is what keeps me up at night. Those were the last good cards I had on the night and I eventually finished out of the money.
Did I make a good lay down? Should I have called? Should I have pushed all in, the only reasonable re-raise at that point? Did I mess up by checking the flop? Or is that just poker? Looking back, I feel like I should have played straight-forward and bet the flop, others may have folded assuming I have the flush, but of course hind-sight is always 20/20. How would you have played that situation?
Answer: Thanks for the question. And you can make your check out to... LOL just kidding
The first point I want to make is about flops like this -- where you have an openended straight flush draw. Compare when you have JsTs and the flop is Ad - 9s - 8s with a flop like you had where you have the middle only. Often times you don't want to catch the flush in that situation because someone else drawing against you will have the bigger one. The flush draw in hands like this only gives you two extra nut outs, the rest may be tainted (giving someone else the winner).
With this in mind, you really only want to catch a straight, but even then there could be a redraw to a spade to kill your hand. Also, you could already be beat. It looks like a pretty flop, but it is one that will most likely just get you into trouble if there is a lot of action. Looking back, what are the possible hands the opponent may have?
1. Ace high spade draw. With an Ace high spade draw, all your outs are gone for spades obviously, plus you are dead to an Ace too. Even though you are ahead now, you aren't ahead by much and what makes matters worse is if the opponent plays the hand aggressively, you'll be in a tough spot.
2. Jack and gutshot or spade too. The next option is that the person only has a pair of Jacks, in which case you might be able to hit the straight or a spade draw to win. The problem with this though is that most likely the kicker of the pair of Jacks will fit nicely in this board; a card may hit that makes you a straight but gives your opponent a larger one -- same is true for the spade.
3. Already a flush or straight.
Only two cards can come off that give you the nuts, the rest are all really scare cards. Even if all the cards are blanks, you still won't be able to bet your hand with much confidence since even a Jack beats you. So I think you made the right lay down. Against only two opponents, I probably would have fired at the flop some to see what their reaction was. But if the person made a large raise, I would be hard pressed to play the hand much farther. There are a lot of flops like this that look good, but actually don't give you that strong of a hand. Most of the one card straight flush draws are like this.
I was watching the WPT a little bit ago and I saw some guy make a really bad call for all his chips in a hand like this. I think he had Q8 and the flop gave him an openended straight flush draw with the 8. The problem of course was the opponent had a bigger flush draw, so he was only drawing to two of his outs for the flush. That hand knocked him out and it was totally needless.
Let me finish up mentioning a similar style of hand and how I actually prefer it. Let's say you have something not that great like AdTs preflop. The flop comes back all diamonds: Kd - Td - 4d. I would feel much more comfortable going all-in against another player here than I would above. The reason is that any diamond gives me the nuts, plus most likely any Ten or Ace wins the pot for me too. Who knows, even the Ten might be good right now.
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