05-17-06, LearnTexasHoldem:
Pushing Or Calling All-in With Draws
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I was at .25/50c no limit cash table online.. I was dealt A/8H and was able to limp in..The flop came 9s/ 5h / 7h.. The first player to act raised $2.. I decided to get cute and reraise him to $4. He then proceed to put me all in for my last $12 or so.. I called this, and rivered the 3h for the nut flush and took down a nice little pot.. With roughly 9 outs for the nut flush, potentially the two 8's(assuming my opponent has flopped a straight) for a split pot,I stand by my play and would make it again if put in the same situation. Gambling is a big part of this game,isn't it ?
Well,as you could probably imagine, I began to catch all sorts of heat from others at the table.Apparntly they didn't like my play,to say the least.
Although we have never played together,I can assure you that I am not a Poker "buffoon" as I like to call folks from time to time.. I have been playing the game now for 4 yrs and am always trying to bring my game to the next level.. I saw his all-in reraise as a golden oppurtunity to double up my stack.
What is your take on this scenario. ?
Thanks,
Greg in MA.
Answer:
Here are a couple thoughts:
1. Don't underestimate the value of being the bettor versus the caller. If you push all-in versus having to call all-in, it isn't he same, even with the same cards. Say in the above hand your opponent had TT. Once he gets his money in the pot, you can't bet him out (obviously). For you to win, you'll have to catch up. On the other hand if you were the one who was able to get the money in first, his call with the TT would be harder. Your chances go way up. This is often the difference between making the play or not. Most players, if they have a big stack, would prefer not to lose it all on a draw if they have to call. They would be much more comfortable betting it for all the chips.
2. Some draws are stronger than others. If you have a garden variety flush draw, you only have the 9 outs. If you have the garden variety straight draw, you only have 8 outs. Compare those two hands with the one above if your opponent had something like TT to KK. Not only do you have the nut flush draw, but you have the inside straight draw and an Ace overcard. I've lost plenty of pairs like JJ and QQ to players who went all-in on the flop with a flush draw and an overcard. It's a strong hand, especially when bet aggressively. So I don't think you played this hand badly, even if the guy had a strong hand too.
3. Don't think that a flush and straight draw can only be raised or mucked. Often times the correct play is just to call the flop bet and see what happens on the turn. At that point you may get bet out, but it's ok. See these kinds of hands take a lot of finesse because you have to accurately guess how much you could potentially win if you do hit. The factors are who your opponent is, his state of mind, how obvious your hand is if you catch, and how deep you both are (how many chips). I may call some big bets against one player, but not another, because I know that if I catch my hand, I can bust the guy for all he has, while the other guy would be more cautious -- implied odds. Flush draws are harder to get paid off on than straights, because everyone is aware of three of one suit being on the board. The more deceptive your draw is, the more likely you'll be able to extract some big bets.
4. I want to finish up by mentioning why some people raise with draws. First of all, if there is a chance that your opponent will fold, then raising makes sense. This is the biggest reason to raise. The flip side is that if you know your opponent will reraise or won't fold, then raising isn't good. You are putting more money in with a hand that is behind. This would be equivalent to bluffing a calling station -- you know he'll call, so it makes no sense. The second reason to raise is because you want to get a free card. This works well against players who you know like to slow play their big hands and checkraise the turn. You can use that against them to get free cards. You raise them on the flop some, then check the turn. It costs you less.
The last reason you raise is because of value. This is the least likely reason to raise a draw in no limit holdem, since most of the pots are heads up or threeway. Raising for value means you think you have the best hand, or will have the best hand by the time the hand is over, so you want to get more money in the pot. The reason I listed these is because often times we just slump into routine play, without remembering why we made a play originally. If you constantly think in terms of underlying concepts, then your play will be more fluid and accurate. You might raise in one hand while calling in another.
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